tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8219781724285312648.post814871760774558216..comments2024-01-25T05:05:26.688-08:00Comments on Stuff Apostolics Like: #131-Not Gay PeopleJoel Rileyhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15449770157998900843noreply@blogger.comBlogger38125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8219781724285312648.post-60776141038203167172014-01-26T01:40:30.737-08:002014-01-26T01:40:30.737-08:00She knew a lesbian so all gay people are immoral p...She knew a lesbian so all gay people are immoral potty mouths and that resonates with you? I hope no one from another race or religion ever makes you angry... Wow...Glenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00765389996081848929noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8219781724285312648.post-3781811892884303792014-01-25T11:52:19.024-08:002014-01-25T11:52:19.024-08:00Lynne your opinion echo's a lot of us. I agree...Lynne your opinion echo's a lot of us. I agree.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8219781724285312648.post-72783313849729284282011-12-03T07:44:37.162-08:002011-12-03T07:44:37.162-08:00Now they have the Affirming PEntecostal Church.. y...Now they have the Affirming PEntecostal Church.. you don't know how many Bible colelge students and young males called to ministry deal with homosexuality or bisexuality andnever come out.. would shouck you.. and this is in the apostolic movement.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8219781724285312648.post-29414815572422980202010-03-22T19:07:45.754-07:002010-03-22T19:07:45.754-07:00I partially agree, and partially grossly disagree....I partially agree, and partially grossly disagree.<br />I agree that God changes peoples lives and that a person who continues in their behavior after they've given their lives to God isn't in a position to be in any kind of ministry.<br />However, we are not God, we do not know His time frame, or His order of doing things. If there's one thing our movement is guilty of it is the quest to see visible, measurable, tangible results in OUR time frame, and when we don't see them we begin the process of ostracization.<br />The bottom line is that we have TWO jobs - love people and love God. It's not our job to change them, convert them, give them orders or hold up any sort of measuring stick.<br />So I agree, they should change when they encounter God, but we are in no position whatsoever to assess that change.<br />True, we shouldn't put someone in ministries or in any situation that may cause any problems, but as long as they're still coming God is still working and it's not up to us to put a time frame on that process.Glenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00765389996081848929noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8219781724285312648.post-37598467675533561652010-03-22T09:34:24.807-07:002010-03-22T09:34:24.807-07:00Of course you have to love. However, love doesnt e...Of course you have to love. However, love doesnt excuse sin. If people are going out murdering and coming back to church we still have to love them even though they are murderers. Same goes for homosexuals. God does, however, require change. Just because a person is taking a stand against sin, doing their best to live above sin through the power of the Holy Ghost, does not mean they do not love people. Love is a cop-out and excuse to do whatever you want because people do not want to change their lives. Its misused and misunderstood.Lynnenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8219781724285312648.post-89978220008789932792010-03-22T08:23:24.610-07:002010-03-22T08:23:24.610-07:00This is a bit radical...but what Anonymous said in...This is a bit radical...but what Anonymous said in the last couple of posts is what I was hinting at at the end of my earlier post.<br /><br />I am 100% in agreement that homosexuality is wrong and that it should not be preached across the pulpit as an accepted "practice" and what not.<br /><br />However, over the last couple of months I've become a firm believer in the concept of love and the power of God's love for us as is taught in the Scripture. As Apostolics we say with our mouths that we love, but our mindsets and our actions say otherwise. I don't look down on anybody, Apostolic or not, that has a firm belief in holiness and righteous...something that we pride ourselves on so much but we like to excuse our lack of love and lack of understanding of God's love by hiding behind the banner of holiness and taking a stand against all else.<br /><br />During tight binds like this we like to throw out bible verses like the one that says we ought to obey God rather than man and we're AOK with taking an unpopular stance...but have you ever thought about taking an un-popular stance within our own Apostolic culture?<br /><br />I believe that the Bible teaches fairness, practicality, moderation, and deep thought. Though the Bible gives a long litany of the kind of people that won't enter into the kingdom of heaven I believe that that is talking about un-regenerate people that never knew God.<br /><br />Salvation is not as plain and simple as we'd like to make it out to be. The Acts 2:38 1,2,3s of salvation isn't as cut and dry as we wish it was. If you start asking yourself some questions about certain things...you'll be left stumpped.<br /><br />With that in mind, I know that there are some individuals that firmly believe the Apostle's doctrine, went down in Jesus' name and were filled with the Holy Ghost and are truly anointed. Who are we to say how far God's grace will extend? Who are we to serve as the gatekeepers of heaven? Or job is to proclaim the kingdom of God and show people love.<br /><br />If we believe that the homosexual that is in the church is wrong, which I'm sure we all do, then our Christian duty is to take them to the side and talk with them about it, show them the Scripture and let God deal with them. they could be stubborn and hard headed, they could never have been saved in the first place, it may be the emotional struggle of their life. Honestly...we're human beings and we simply JUST DON'T KNOW.<br /><br />Why don't we learn to be REAL with ourselvs and others and maybe...just maybe more people will come into the church and accept Christ.<br /><br />Love is what get's people into the church not tongues. And it's questioning previous held notions that bring a person into deeper knowledge.<br /><br />o yeah follow me on twitter if you have 1! lol. @fireduppk238Louis D.http://www.twitter.com/fireduppk238noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8219781724285312648.post-16315028833388743262010-03-22T07:42:57.856-07:002010-03-22T07:42:57.856-07:00But we all sin. We are imperfect and will be until...But we all sin. We are imperfect and will be until the return of Jesus Christ so we are still living in sin. I don't care if it's homosexuality or something else, sin is sin.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8219781724285312648.post-77239537208117856202010-03-22T00:19:00.742-07:002010-03-22T00:19:00.742-07:00However, the purpose of the Holy Ghost is to live ...However, the purpose of the Holy Ghost is to live above sin. Not to live IN sin. I, by no means, agree with this statement because it completely denies the purpose of the Holy Ghost. Knowingly living in sin is wrong: would you apply the same thing to a murderer. If he or she was so-called filled with the Holy Ghost, but still went around killing someone...that is definitely not Biblically sound. True repentance means to turn away from your sin, not to keep living in it. And, you haven`t repented if you are still sinning. It completely negates the entire purpose of salvation, believing this way. God does extend his grace and mercy, but there is a time for judgement as well.Lynnenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8219781724285312648.post-56930131678892256212010-03-21T22:47:49.789-07:002010-03-21T22:47:49.789-07:00I like where your head's at.I like where your head's at.Glenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00765389996081848929noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8219781724285312648.post-88171811431009341232010-03-21T20:17:25.919-07:002010-03-21T20:17:25.919-07:00Just throwing this out there,
Titus 3:5 "No...Just throwing this out there, <br /><br />Titus 3:5 "Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost."<br /><br />Since we all have sinned and still do, I would just like propose the concept that gay's who love God, were filled with the Holy Ghost and Baptized, will go to Heaven. They are in sin (just as we all are in sin) but that doesn't bar them from Heaven.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8219781724285312648.post-41888467832593562172010-03-21T18:17:35.489-07:002010-03-21T18:17:35.489-07:00"Last 3 weeks ago" --- hahahaha"Last 3 weeks ago" --- hahahahaAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8219781724285312648.post-76791877467395771842010-03-20T18:29:26.290-07:002010-03-20T18:29:26.290-07:00Homosexuality is the ultimate selfishness, the abo...Homosexuality is the ultimate selfishness, the abomination, the most distorted and final outcome of a sinful heart. <br /><br />How do you respond? <br /><br />I think you are losing some fans when you start supporting (politically) gay marriage. It attempts to put everyone in the same box, and fall into the trap that if one doesn't agree with changing the institution of legal marriage, they must be unloving or even angry. I don't think that's fair or honest for that particular subject, which could take up hours of debate. There's some good ones out there. <br /><br />Otherwise, I think this is well-said. It's not isolated to Apostolic/Classical Pentecostals either. Pretty much the entire Evangelical movement. <br /><br />Recently someone said they couldn't live in a particular city because "there are too many fags." I understand the human reaction to be normal where we all see something so blatantly distorted, but its troublesome to develop an attitude that creates a class of lepers. Even if they are bold about their sin, lying beneath the surface is a soul that seeks love and compassion -- and of course unashamed truth. We need not be insecure about our positions on this issue. <br /><br />By the way, enjoying this post.Saranoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8219781724285312648.post-30125583996033835162010-03-20T15:05:21.501-07:002010-03-20T15:05:21.501-07:00You may cringe, and that's ok. I do too someti...You may cringe, and that's ok. I do too sometimes. But cringing and telling them they don't have the right to express that affection, natural or not, are two different things.<br />I agree, it isn't natural. There's nothing "right" about it, but regardless of all that, in our democracy, they should have every freedom that you and I share.<br />I would tend to disagree that all, or even the majority, of gays are "miserable". I think some can be very conflicted, experiencing a broad array of emotions, but I don't attribute it to them not being happy in their lifestyle, I attribute it to them having the same struggles that any other person has.<br />I know miserable straight people. I know miserable married couples. I know miserable preachers, ministers, teachers and doctors. We don't look at any random person dealing with stress in their life and say "Oh you're stressed because you're straight" or "You've got problems because you're a single". So why make the leap that just because a gay person may be unhappy it's automatically correlated to them being gay?<br />I do see what you're saying, and I'm sure that in some cases it is true, but let's be careful not to over generalize and simplify the classification.<br /><br />One thing I want to say, to Darla and everyone commenting - THANK YOU! Thank you thank you thank you! The civility and open mindedness is something I never thought I would see in a discussion regarding this sensitive of a subject. I believe, based on what I have seen here and elsewhere that the days of brow beating, bigotry and hate mongering are behind us. The voices I'm seeing in our movement give me hope that the simpleton logic that has dominated for years is losing its grip, and logic has paired with intellectualism to breed a much more adept, tactical Christianity.<br />Thank you to all of you, God bless.Glenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00765389996081848929noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8219781724285312648.post-92002656317916314322010-03-20T11:00:19.761-07:002010-03-20T11:00:19.761-07:00Except, Glen, that it is unnatural for man with ma...Except, Glen, that it is unnatural for man with man and woman with woman (according to God), so yes, I will cringe to see them kissing each other. <br /><br />Again, my dad is an alcoholic. I grew up around his friends. My dad and his friends always had a good time, but were miserable creatures after the fact and couldn't hide it. I see homosexuals who are both miserable "after the fact" (I know some personally and consider them my friend), and some who proclaim loudly they are very happy and do not seem in any way miserable in their choice. They do not want redemption.<br /><br />That's the difference I am talking about.<br /><br />Thanks for the great discussion.Darlanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8219781724285312648.post-51135817192143274632010-03-20T10:57:47.509-07:002010-03-20T10:57:47.509-07:00Governmental opinion and moral opinion are quite s...Governmental opinion and moral opinion are quite separate (or at least should be seen distinct). One reflects a view of how the government should function and response to particular issues, and the other is how God responds, thus how the Church should respond to particular issues. Unfortunately, it's more than an occasional "bleed over" but a definite amalgamation that has taken place. <br /><br />Be a citizen of a republic, but that must always be second to our citizenship for a Higher Kingdom.Saranoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8219781724285312648.post-54048096702611857752010-03-20T09:57:32.068-07:002010-03-20T09:57:32.068-07:00I appreciate the last few comments. Of course homo...I appreciate the last few comments. Of course homosexuality isn’t the only sin being flaunted under our noses. Every sin is flaunted under our nose. We’re just callused to the other sins & homosexuality still makes people uncomfortable. We don’t understand it & we’re fearful of it.<br /><br />Biblically–is homosexuality a sin? Yes. Should churches recognize gay marriages? No. However, on a governmental level this is different.<br /><br />I'll say this–we're not, nor have we ever been a Christian nation. Our country wasn’t founded based on a religion. We were founded with many belief’s in mind, but one of them is that everyone has the freedom to practice whatever they believe, or not practice any religious belief. It gets tiresome to hear people say that the founding fathers wouldn’t support gay marriage. Sure they wouldn’t know what to make of it, but they wouldn’t restrict it right off the bat, I don’t believe.<br /><br />Here’s a few quotes to illustrate their thoughts:<br /><br />“I never submitted the whole system of my opinions to the creed of any party of men whatever in religion, in philosophy, in politics, or in anything else where I was capable of thinking for myself. Such an addiction is the last degradation of a free & moral agent.” <br /><br />“Christianity neither is, nor ever was a part of the common law.”<br /><br />- Thomas Jefferson<br /><br />"I almost shudder at the thought of alluding to the most fatal example of the abuses of grief which the history of mankind has preserved--the Cross. Consider what calamities that engine of grief has produced!"<br /><br />-John Adams<br /><br />And that’s just a few. The bottom line is that our founding fathers were deists, atheists, Christians & agnostics. They wrote the constitution to be all-inclusive, of broad views & belief’s.<br /><br />To say that the founding fathers would have put something in the constitution that specified marriage to a man & a woman because of their ‘religious beliefs’, they just couldn’t have predicted the debate coming, is the epitome of projecting our held belief’s onto them.<br /><br />What our constitution IS based on is my right to do whatever makes me happy as long as it doesn’t infringe on any of your rights. PERIOD. You can do whatever you want in this country as long as your freedoms don’t take away from mine & while I DO believe that homosexuality is a sin, I do not support the bigoted and malicious view that in our system of government anyone should be denied their basic liberties because I find it ICKY.<br /><br />You may say “Well I don’t want to see it”. Well they don’t want to see you kissing your wife, carrying your bible and coaching your kids soccer games, but that’s what’s great about this country: they can’t stop you from living your life and your belief’s.<br /><br />The day we start legislating our religion is the day we join the Islamic theocracies which we love to hate. It’s also the day we have to figure out what our national religion would be, & if you think it would be oneness Pentecostalism you’re fooling yourself.<br /><br />The words “separation of church & state” aren’t in the constitution, but they are words which were spoken by its framers that describe what they had in mind when they wrote it.<br /><br />As great as Christianity is, and as infallible as I believe the Word of God is, the inability of humanity to agree on it is exactly why it was left out of our constitution, and should continue to be left out. Churches HAVE to function independent of the government because when the two mix we it’s a recipe for disaster.<br /><br />So again, we don’t have to like it, we don’t have to be happy about it, but we do have to RESPECT the fact that regardless of what someone’s belief’s are in this country they have the right to practice them as long as they don’t infringe upon yours.Glenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00765389996081848929noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8219781724285312648.post-34390437400434001422010-03-20T08:20:11.660-07:002010-03-20T08:20:11.660-07:00Pretty sure I see fornicators, adulterers, alcohol...Pretty sure I see fornicators, adulterers, alcoholics and drug addicts who flaunt their sin every day. Pretty sure at one point I was one of them who tried to reason away what I was doing. Pretty sure God knocked me upside the head and set me straight. Maybe, if you don't see people flaunting any other sin besides homosexuality you may not be paying attention. Or perhaps you live in a very small town. I don't know. <br />I appreciate this post so much. Basically it is addressing how easily we judge others. That is my biggest pet peeve. Just because our skirt is a certain length and our trimmed hair is tied up in a knot so no one can see, we somehow have the right to judge anyone who doesn't look like us or who wasn't raised like us. Jesus' entire ministry was against that attitude. He called out the Pharisees and other religious leaders who looked the part, but had judgmental hearts. He showed love to the outcasts, (the Samaritans of his day) and specifically said, I do not condemn you. He ate and fellowshipped with sinners who had yet to repent. <br />I am so thankful someone didn't judge me but finally after a years of searching showed me the true love of God. I had never truly felt loved by God, just judged. Its an amazing feeling to finally find love, forgiveness and the power to change lifestyle habits.ohbutforgracenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8219781724285312648.post-44996842951040758672010-03-20T07:45:13.352-07:002010-03-20T07:45:13.352-07:00Joel said:
"We have ministries to save drug ...Joel said:<br /><br />"We have ministries to save drug addicts, fornicators, and alcoholics, but we do not know how/or want to touch the reconciliation of homosexuals with the God that wants so dearly to love them. We are God's helping hand, and we keep it open to every kind of sinner to salvation, but that of the gay person."<br /><br />Anonymous: You have missed the point. Homosexuals who want to "marry" (and I DEFINITELY am not on the same page as you as to legalizing that) or who flaunt it are NOT repentant and are not looking for deliverance or reconciliation.Darlanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8219781724285312648.post-50051046328167746562010-03-20T01:29:49.095-07:002010-03-20T01:29:49.095-07:00Well Darla I have to ask you a question. I can und...Well Darla I have to ask you a question. I can understand not wanting someone to flaunt their sexual endeavors in your face, but I will most likely support someone who marches for something especially if it's a freedom of this nature. I may not agree with being homosexual, but I believe that they should have the right to be joined in a legal union. I would not call it marriage, for that is a term with origins going back to the church I believe(correct me if I'm wrong) but I still believe that they have a right to legal union. America was founded as a government with a separation between church and state. Marriage between a man and a woman is a Christian thing, why should they be subject to someone else's belief. If our nation truly allowed people to have that freedom, then gays would be allowed to marry. I have no problem with a gay parade because they should have that right. Are you proud to be a Christian? They to are proud of who they are. I completely understand you when you do not desire to hear about what takes place in the relationship, but they should have the right to organize and rally for their cause.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8219781724285312648.post-7033082201284172952010-03-19T12:54:03.213-07:002010-03-19T12:54:03.213-07:00After rethinking what I said previously, I think m...After rethinking what I said previously, I think my point is better said like this: (although it may be redundant).<br /><br />I have a BIG problem with homosexuals who flaunt their lifestyle. They are the ones who take part in Gay Pride parades, etc. You do not see alcoholics, drug addicts, and even fornicators or adulterers having a big parade to flaunt their lifestyle. Most of them realize they are bound by their addiction and realize that it is nothing to flaunt.<br /><br />So, for the homosexuals seeking deliverance from their problem - the church should be there 100 percent for them, working with them and showing compassion. Not pounding the pulpit and condemning them to hell, either. They are NOT the ones that flaunt it. But for the ones who do flaunt this "unnatural" lifestyle - God's words - you'll receive my compassion only when you stop flaunting it. <br /><br />Sorry if that's harsh, but in thinking this discussion through, that's what it comes down to for me.Darlanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8219781724285312648.post-27067762946328713842010-03-19T08:29:18.533-07:002010-03-19T08:29:18.533-07:00Lynne: "I dont want to be desensitized to sex...Lynne: "I dont want to be desensitized to sexual perversion"<br /><br />That is very true. I feel personally that I have become (somewhat) desensitized to homosexuality since living in an area where it is so much more common. Even though when I see it, it still upsets me, it doesn't surprise me any more... which was not the case at all 5, 10 years ago.<br /><br />That being said, it also doesn't surprise me when I turn on the news and hear about a cop being shot to death, girl being raped, or a drug overdose killing a teenager.<br /><br />Makes one sit and reevaluate personal morals & values.<br /><br />To Angry Anon: Being "fat" in the context that was described in the previous post has to do with willingly shoving 3 pies down ones throat or eating till you can hardly breathe. So to make a comparison between these two posts seems silly in my opinion.<br /><br />Homosexuality is often times a very deep issue that has roots in a persons childhood, etc. that REQUIRES a compassionate approach in order to see full redemption.<br /><br />Overeating to the point of obesity however is a day to day choice that can be overcome by common sense. <br /><br />PS. Obesity that is linked to medical issues that has nothing to do with food intake is not what I'm talking about.Rachel Rhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17900893007963636814noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8219781724285312648.post-81937002085451065052010-03-19T07:58:38.798-07:002010-03-19T07:58:38.798-07:00To Angry Anonymous Guy...
The Fatties are never c...To Angry Anonymous Guy...<br /><br />The Fatties are never called out. The Gay and Lesbian folks are always marked for shunning. Read the blog titles...<br /><br />THINK! It changes thingsStantonhttp://www.bethelloves.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8219781724285312648.post-59549261032887546632010-03-19T07:15:31.732-07:002010-03-19T07:15:31.732-07:00I think you've opened up a can of worms with t...I think you've opened up a can of worms with this one, Joel. But allow me to be the Foucauldian and interject this refrain: let's please be careful not to turn this into a "enlightened" view/generation vs. a backwards view/generation. All viewpoints expressed here are human understandings/conceptions of Truth and are therefore necessarily stained by subjectivity.<br /><br />Let's remember that the open, understanding way of behaving toward homosexuals is itself often times bound by a panoply of anachronistic assumptions that have their origins not in a Godly conception of the human condition, but in the eighteenth century creation of the subjective self.<br /><br />Am I justifying the fearful, onanistic attacks on homosexuals by the preachers mentioned above? Of course not (I think discussing the narrative/structural requirements of a "successful" sermon would be fascinating future blog post/potential dissertation topic.) What I am trying to say is that we should not, can not, be satisfied with one way of seeing things because in the end it is constrained by our human faculties. <br /><br />Let's keep speaking about this, keep bringing up topics that make us uncomfortable and shake our understanding, but let's not allow these new avenues of thought to become reified as truths.Chady Hosinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14701331138931021729noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8219781724285312648.post-29991357253289772532010-03-18T22:57:50.813-07:002010-03-18T22:57:50.813-07:00LOLZ @ ANGRY ANONYMOUS GUYLOLZ @ ANGRY ANONYMOUS GUYAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8219781724285312648.post-25530073163295287592010-03-18T22:36:21.906-07:002010-03-18T22:36:21.906-07:00I think its interesting that the fatties are being...I think its interesting that the fatties are being called out but the homos need more compassion!!! WOW!!! This blog REALLY does make me SICK!!!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com